Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

topic posted Wed, February 4, 2004 - 12:25 PM by  Unsubscribed
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  • M
    M
    offline 0

    Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

    Wed, February 4, 2004 - 1:21 PM
    Great Film! I have one question though. Why does the environment look so lush?
    • Unsu...
       

      Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

      Wed, February 4, 2004 - 1:30 PM
      I'm not sure, maybe the soil is not fertile enough to grow crops or maybe the people of the village don't have enough seeds to plant in the soil?
      • Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

        Wed, February 4, 2004 - 2:07 PM
        Or perhaps people are currently lacking the economic resources to afford building up a more agricultural society. It would be interesting to hear what the maker of the documentary has to say on this issue.
        • Unsu...
           

          Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

          Fri, February 6, 2004 - 2:27 PM
          Hi, just joined this posting because i wanted to follow the program up.. (I have a professional interest).

          From what I could see fertility in this area is not the predominant issue. It may well be that the soils are depleated (phospohorus being the likely shortage) or suffering from Aluminium toxicity (result of acidification breaking down the clay minerals) but what struck me was the scarcity of variety. These people were eating roadside and field weeds.. why no catch cropping? It may well be that the availability of land is restricted so that there is insufficient per head to adequately support. It looked to me that what these people needed was education.. how to and what to grow. After all this part of the World has seen some of the longest and bloodiest of wars over the last 30 years.. perhaps just surviving is all they can manage.
    • Ron
      Ron
      offline 1

      Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

      Sat, February 7, 2004 - 6:10 AM
      Everyone has asked this question. According to what the crew were told, the land lacks nutrients because it has been over farmed for hundreds of years. Whilst it can support certain plants, it can not support plants that are useful for food in any decent quantities. We also think, as does another contributer to this site, that eductation is a big issue.

      Ron McCullagh, Exec Producer, Living With Hunger
      • Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

        Sat, February 7, 2004 - 3:56 PM
        After watching "Living With Hunger" I found myself wondering how I would feed my family if I had no money, little land and poor soil. The most valuable vegetable in my garden is the nettle.

        Would it be worth researching the use of this amazingly versatile plant? They grow in poor soil, and are high in vitamins A, B and C, iron and minerals. The arial parts (leaves and stem) make a very nutritious vegetable soup and can also be drunk as a tea (they can be dried for later use).

        It can also be used as a green manure and is excellent for speeding up the composting process of organic matter - within two weeks it will produce a liquid feed (containing magnesium, sulphur and iron; nettles collected in the spring are high in nitrogen, potash and phosphate) for growing vegetables.

        I feel it deserves a serious look.
      • Unsu...
         

        Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

        Sat, February 7, 2004 - 4:10 PM
        Hi Ron,
        thanks for the reply... I think that anyone who has given the whole poverty and hunger issue any serious thought puts the bulk od the solution down to education.

        As regards tropical soils there is a lot of fallacy about infertility. Whilst Africa has some of the most impoverished of soils, largely due to the lack of recent mountain building. I generally aver that it is poor method rather than am inherent failing in the soil . Those fields were unlikely to have been irreversibly infertile, they may have been impoverished but this can be addressed. I can not over emphasise how important a factor lack of crop choice is. Not just in terms of yeild but nutritionally both for the soil and the farmers.

        Its a great shame that very few of the aid agencies put much effort into developing better crop and varietal choice in subsistence systems. A miniscule amount of effort could truely transform the productivity and sustainability of many subsistance farmers.

        regarding your statement "Whilst it can support certain plants, it can not support plants that are useful for food in any decent quantities."

        No disrespect Ron but this doesn't actually make sense -- the only difference between a crop and a weed is nomenclature and the only thing all crop plants have in common is that they are crop plants. If a given soil is capable of supporting plant life then it is possible for that plant life to be edible.

        Perhaps it will change...
        • Ron
          Ron
          offline 1

          Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

          Thu, February 12, 2004 - 9:58 AM
          None taken. I have nothing to add to your mail. It all makes sense!!

          Of course education plays an enourmous role in hunger. And I agree no one is doing enough to teach. One of the things we are trying to do with the newsletter (which, by the way you can sign up to back at insightnewstv.com/hunger) is tell all those who wish to donate about a group we are working with near Kirkos.

          This group have the skills to build a school for Kirkos and surrounding villages. That is the type of project we think will - long term - make a difference.

          All views welcome.

          Best

          Ron McCullagh
          • Unsu...
             

            Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

            Fri, February 13, 2004 - 3:10 AM
            HI Ron, glad you haven?t taken offence (yet)., but there's still time!!!


            You say all views are welcome so I would like to share an observation of mine in response to your comment

            "This group have the skills to build a school for Kirkos and surrounding villages. That is the type of project we think will - long term - make a difference".

            Oh dear... another school house, perhaps a clinic too? Why do all western sponsors believe in this 'bolt on a building' approach when it has been shown to fail elsewhere? ? Africa is littered with empty schools and empty clinics that sit like concrete temples in mud hut villages, please don't build another monument to western ideals. If you must build something (no doubt with a little brass commemorative plaque or a brick laid by some dignitary). Then build a place that has many functions.. school, hospital, meeting house, etc.. don't impose a western purpose.

            Buildings are (after all)simply functional.. they in themselves are not solutions and neither are they a requirement, if anything they are a drain on resources.

            Rather than go into specific examples here (IMHO, should I possess such a quality) are a couple of reasons why this approach can and often does lead to the reverse of that intended.

            1) Educating who?
            Schools can only educate those who are not required for work, the better off and the very young. Education has to target all groups in a comprehensive way that does not inflict secondary hardships (ie learning the 3R's at the expense of scavenging for food). These people have to be educated whilst they work.

            With the above aim in mind the UN has long recognised that female education is the priority (first identified at Rio 1992). One cannot emphasise enough the importance of women in early development: an educated mother passes that education directly onto her children with no requirement for a western school.

            2) Encouraging urbanisation?
            Build a school. Clinic or any 'service' in one village and despite any intentions to the contrary you will serve every other nearby village. This can cover quite vast distances and with no ambulances or busses must therefore be traversed by foot.

            Such buildings can provide false comfort that encourages migration.. which at its worst becomes urbanisation and the creation of shanty towns, slums and greater poverty and at best elitism, the haves surrounded by the have nots.

            The solution?
            If you have enough money for schools you must have the money for teachers. As good teachers don't need schools to operate, whilst a school cannot operate without teachers, I would aver that teachers are your priority. Have you given the problem enough consideration?

            I am reminded of an introductory cartoon to a book 'planning with pastoralists' ( very difficult for us 'pikey' westerners) in which the ever keen aid worker having come with his/her pre-determined plan sets out to?

            Aid worker: "what kind of problems do you have"?
            Villager: "well"..?
            Aid worker: "Food security"?
            Villager: "Yes".
            Aid worker: "Well a grain bank is what you need isn't it"?
            Villager: "Yes....but.."?
            Aid worker: "To run the cereal bank, of course, you'll need some functional literacy training, won't you"?
            Villager: "Yes"
            Aid Worker: "And some cement and a metal door for the cereal store room. How about that".
            Villager: "Yes..but.."
            Aid Worker: "A cereal bank, functional literacy and an improved store room. That should do for starters shouldn't it".
            Villager: "Yes... but.."
            Aid worker: "O.K. we'll be back next month. Thank you. Bye"?
            Villager: "....But can't we have a well first"?

            From: A.Waters-Bayer and W.Bayer (1995) Planning with Pastoralists: PRA and more. A review of methods focused on Africa.

            One final note: My postings are by choice provocative. It is my intention, not because I wish to pour scorn or ridicule but because the price of failure is too high?


            Malcolm
            • Ron
              Ron
              offline 1

              Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

              Fri, February 13, 2004 - 5:53 AM
              Malcolm,

              I assure you the people we are working with are:

              1) local, i.e. not Europeans
              2) aware that schools need teachers
              3) probably have a better idea of what the villagers need than either you are me.

              You will have every opportunity to comment on their proposals when they make them since they will be published in the newsletter.

              Ron McCullagh

              • Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

                Sun, February 15, 2004 - 9:28 AM

                Ron, I'm a practical man. I was greatly moved by your film. I own a rural business in Dorset, UK. I've heard about the Seeds for Africa campaign. I'm thinking about getting a team of people to go out with hand tools, fertilisers and seeds. Would we just 'get in the way'?
            • Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

              Fri, February 13, 2004 - 5:55 AM
              Dear Malcolm

              I was part of the team that filmed in Kirkos last summer. I would like to point out in reply to your post that the villagers themselves asked for only one thing when we left. The exact words of the village chairman were: “If you come back in 5 years or 10 years time - I do not mind but please do not forget we want a school in this village more than anything”. In all our discussions with the village in regards to aid we asked them what they thought the village most needed. It was not an idea brought up by the film crew. Consideration for long term employment of teachers will be at the forefront of any plans to build a school in Kirkos.

              Best regards
              George Waldrum
              • Unsu...
                 

                Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

                Sat, February 14, 2004 - 9:08 AM
                My apologies gents,

                I appear to have been under a misapprehension. I shall explain?.

                After watching ?Living with Hunger? I came away with the impression that the point of the film was to tackle hunger. As an agricultural soil scientist I am invariable biased in favour of this science and what it has to offer with regard to poverty and starvation issues in agronomically dependent economies. This is a view I have long held and the reason why I have spent over ten years studying the discipline. It is also why I chose to follow up the program.

                Having noted the content of your replies to my posts I realise that as a solution, improved agricultural practices and production is not the issue or at least not the principle issue with regard to the problems at Kirkos or the surrounding area.

                As such I have nothing tangible to contribute but wish you well in your project and hope that should you be successful in building a school that it achieves the aims of the film and fulfils the ambitions of the villages, if not their bellies.

                Once again I wish you success
  • Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

    Sun, February 8, 2004 - 11:49 AM
    Harrowing film - one thing I did not understand was the reason for the insufficient aid getting to the distribution admin... the admin guy said he was not sent the correct amount each month, so could not pass on the right amount per person. But the Government tells us they have enough to send out... where is the error? Is this the aid going places it should not (why? surely the agencies track and enforce distro of what is actually sent!) or are the figures just wrong?
  • Re: Surviving Hunger, Ethiopia

    Thu, February 26, 2004 - 7:53 AM
    I am new to the board and am joining because I thought sharing my ideas and experience regarding this issue might be a good idea.

    The documentary indeed was impressive and I appreciate the courage and determination of Sorious Samura. He has done his share to show to the world what it takes to lead that kind of life and how hard it is.

    As an Ethiopian, most of my encounters with other nationals have been quite disturbing. The first thing that comes to their mind is "hunger". Of course, this is a fact and undeniable. But there is more into being an Ethiopian than mere hunger. First of all, the country is too big to be represented by what is shown on the international media. To your surprise, I have never seen, though I can't say that it has never been reported, a report on major international media of what positive things that country has got. As much as there is drought in some places, there are regions that are extremely rich in natural resources. As a reminder, I would like to bring to your attention that Ethiopia is one of the 12 countries around the world to join the list of countries with the highest Plant diversity (I have read one post that mentioned something about diversity but didn't grasp the idea). What this means is that, there are a number of crops and wild plants that originated or diversified in Ethiopia (this is the research are that I am directly involved in). To mention some crops - sorghum, wheat, barley, tef. There are a number of endemic and indigenous wild plant species (this is also true for some animal species like Ibex and the Semien Fox, which are endemic and endangered species). This is accredited to the diverse agro-ecological zones found in the country. Dry to extremely wet, depressions (by the way, the lowest depression in the world is found in Ethiopia – a place called Dalol and is 116 m below see level) to mountains as high as 4,500m. Nile and many other big rivers have their source in Ethiopia. The country indeed is endowed by many natural wealth. As a matter of fact, one might tend to ask an important question. If the country is as gifted as you are saying it is, why is it then people are dying of hunger?

    I would like to respond to this answer to the very best of my experience. I was involved in a certain research funded by a foreign donor to do some plant diversity studies, specifically sorghum, in areas very close to where Sorious has been. I had the chance to observe some of the places “famous” for their “hungriness”. One very important thing that I was able to observe is that farmers in those region (this is also true for almost all Ethiopian farmers) are subsistence farmers and use traditional farming system. I used to think, as might some of you in the discussion board do, that these farmers are way back and need to be thought a lot about modern farm practices. Though there is some truth in it, these farmers DO KNOW a lot about agriculture. Seed storage, seed preparation, soil preparation, planting, weeding, harvesting, again storing – they have got their own ways of doing these activities. As far as I am concerned, in a given agricultural system, biophysical requirements of a crop need to be met if there is going to be a good harvest. Of all the factors, SUN and WATER play the key role. They have the sun, I guess to much of it cause it literally shines the whole year in that area. I think the problem lies in WATER, its use and management. This is the only area that I saw a weakness in their system – It is a purely rain fed agricultural system.

    But, can climatic shift be blamed for all this misery? The answer is NO. Social, cultural and political conditions have an equivalent say. Culture and tradition has got a deep root in that society and one can not go there and overturn everything overnight. Religion has a far fetched influence, to the level that the farmers think God won’t let the rain come if they try to irrigate their land. I once was trying to demonstrate to a certain farmer in that area that irrigation might prove helpful and that they can harvest year round. His response was positive but I knew that it takes more than that to convince him to practice it. Generally, adoption of new techniques or practices is very low. One more thing that should be known is that the relief that is provided to the farmers has weakened their stamina some even consider it and easy way out of the requirement for food.

    Political issues are to complicated and need somebody who has got a better experience or exposure to explain it. But I can say one thing. There has never come, not yet, a government which can uproot the corruption and negligence that is surfacing in most sectors, GO’s or NGO’s, that are directly or indirectly associated with this grave problem.

    If deemed important, I will try to discuss some of our findings that might elaborate some of the things that I mentioned above.

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